Nextor and automatic drive mappings

Page 2/3
1 | | 3

By Meits

Scribe (6446)

Meits's picture

26-08-2021, 14:01

Grauw wrote:

Ah since you ask, I change slots quite often, I swap my MegaFlashROM SCC+ SD between my MSX machines quite a lot and am not paying attention to what slot I insert it in. Also sometimes I change the slot to get some other extension to work. I also share the same SD card between different disk interface extensions, which have different internal slot layouts.

I ran into this slot 1/2 issue long ago with my MegaFlashROM SCC+ SD while mapping the partitions, so I asked Manuel how to find out in which slot the MegaFlashROM SCC+ SD is inserted so I can let the autoexec correctly in both slots.

PEEK(&HF348) AND 3 shows in which slot you inserted the MegaFlashROM SCC+ SD.

It's a bit of knitting basic and batch together, but it works a charm.

By raymond

Hero (535)

raymond's picture

26-08-2021, 22:56

Thanks for all the reactions. I now have a better understanding on how it works. I get my other partitions mapped, but loose my floppy drive. It just doesn't map it on another drive.

By Pencioner

Scribe (1460)

Pencioner's picture

27-08-2021, 01:01

raymond wrote:

Thanks for all the reactions. I now have a better understanding on how it works. I get my other partitions mapped, but loose my floppy drive. It just doesn't map it on another drive.

because Nextor can map over already taken letter by DOS/DOS2 device. therefore, you have to skip the one which was your floppy mapped to, it is a little bit ugly but f.e. on machine with disk drive and MFRSCC+SD with two SD slots i have A and B drives pointing to first partitions of each SD card, then C as floppy, and map other partitions to D and up Smile

By sdsnatcher73

Prophet (2229)

sdsnatcher73's picture

27-08-2021, 05:26

The main reason why I think Nextor should first let internal BDOS mount disk drives and should mount all partitions by default is user experience. And then mostly new user experience. MSX has a big influx of new users and making things work can be a bit problematic. Helping them out on a forum like this would be easier if floppy drives were alway A: and B: and mass storage starts at C: (even if there are no floppy drives). And imho the bulk (at least 80%) of users just want their partitions mounted on boot. Contrary the number of users that mount/unmount/remount partitions manually after boot is (again imho) low. Flexibility for power users should not come with a cost of usability and consistency for the main stream.

@konamiman: Don’t get me wrong, I love Nextor and deeply appreciate immensely all you have done for MSX!!! Above is just an opinion and should not be seen as criticism on your work.

By Manuel

Ascended (18133)

Manuel's picture

27-08-2021, 08:00

Starting at C:, but there are only 8 drive letters possible.... Isn't that a waste?

By konamiman

Paragon (1143)

konamiman's picture

27-08-2021, 09:46

Quote:

Selecting which partitions auto-mount by setting the “active” seems like the perfect solution to me to be honest. (I presume you can set this flag on more than one partition.)

You can flag more than one partition as active, but still, only one (the first suitable one marked as such) will be mapped at boot time.

This seems a bit useless but there's one legitimate use case for that: if you have both a FAT16 partition and a FAT12 partition marked as active, and provided that the FAT16 one comes first, then the FAT16 partition will normally be mounted at boot, but when you boot in DOS 1 mode then the FAT12 one will be mounted instead.

Quote:

Nextor should always let any disk ROM initialize first and let it mount its drives, afterwards Nextor can mount the partitions.

This is partially possible already. However this kind of defeats the whole purpose of the Nextor driver design: completely freeing the driver developer from the drive mapping process since this is actually the task of the OS, not the driver.

Quote:

I disagree, AUTOEXEC.BAT is for when the OS has finished booting, a NEXTOR.INI (or CONFIG.SYS if you compare it to MS-DOS) would configure the OS during boot time.

In an ideal world, maybe. But not that much in the "obsolete computer used by just a bunch of nerds and maintained by one single of these nerds who has very little free time" world in which we are. :)

Quote:

so I asked Manuel how to find out in which slot the MegaFlashROM SCC+ SD is inserted so I can let the autoexec correctly in both slots.

You can always run DRIVERS.COM or CALL DRIVERS. This will show you a nice list of all the existing kernels (both Nextor and MSX-DOS) and the corresponding slot numbers.

Quote:

The main reason why I think Nextor should first let internal BDOS mount disk drives and should mount all partitions by default is user experience. And then mostly new user experience.

I'd say yes and no.

User experience is important, and new user experience even more, yes. But I'd say that anyone coming to the MSX world expecting a Windows-like experience is a little bit clueless: MSX is an old computer, it has an old-fashioned user interface, and getting comfortable with it will take some time no matter what.

So while easy to implement suggestions that make life easier for Nextor user are worth the time they would take (e.g. modifying MAPDRV to take an already mapped drive as a reference for mapping a new one), I think that's not the case for others that would turn how Nextor works upside down and would take a considerable amount of redesign and implementation time (e.g. mapping Nextor drives starting at C: and internal drives starting at A: just because that's what Windows users are used to - and I say this as a happy Windows user!)

Quote:

And imho the bulk (at least 80%) of users just want their partitions mounted on boot.

That may be the case for experienced users, but these are able to use MAPDRV already. New users (imho, too) are better off starting with one single partition in their devices (and why do you need more anyway if you can have 4GB per partition? Again, I'm referring to getting started as a new user).

Quote:

Don’t get me wrong, I love Nextor and deeply appreciate immensely all you have done for MSX!!! Above is just an opinion and should not be seen as criticism on your work.

Nah, don't worry, you hate me and that's it, I get it. ;) :P

By Grauw

Ascended (10061)

Grauw's picture

27-08-2021, 10:35

konamiman wrote:

You can flag more than one partition as active, but still, only one (the first suitable one marked as such) will be mapped at boot time.

This seems a bit useless but there's one legitimate use case for that: if you have both a FAT16 partition and a FAT12 partition marked as active, and provided that the FAT16 one comes first, then the FAT16 partition will normally be mounted at boot, but when you boot in DOS 1 mode then the FAT12 one will be mounted instead.

I think it would be more logical if all active partitions are mounted, as I said it makes a lot of sense to me. About the use case you mention, what’s wrong with DOS2 having the FAT12 partition accessible? That seems useful if you need to copy something over for DOS1 mode. If it’s the only reason to not mount all active partitions, I wouldn’t let that hold it back.

konamiman wrote:

e.g. mapping Nextor drives starting at C: and internal drives starting at A: just because that's what Windows users are used to - and I say this as a happy Windows user!

I wouldn’t like it, the MSX that is familiar to me starts its hard drives with A: not C: Tongue.

By raymond

Hero (535)

raymond's picture

28-08-2021, 10:32

Pencioner wrote:
raymond wrote:

Thanks for all the reactions. I now have a better understanding on how it works. I get my other partitions mapped, but loose my floppy drive. It just doesn't map it on another drive.

because Nextor can map over already taken letter by DOS/DOS2 device. therefore, you have to skip the one which was your floppy mapped to, it is a little bit ugly but f.e. on machine with disk drive and MFRSCC+SD with two SD slots i have A and B drives pointing to first partitions of each SD card, then C as floppy, and map other partitions to D and up Smile

I would have expected to mount the drive again at G: with the proper information, however, it doesn't let me. I always used a Sunrise IDE interface so this feels a bit clumsy to have my floppy at B:...

I am happy though that the other partitions can be mounted properly and I have a lot of free space available Big smile

By raymond

Hero (535)

raymond's picture

28-08-2021, 10:34

Grauw wrote:

I think it would be more logical if all active partitions are mounted, as I said it makes a lot of sense to me. About the use case you mention, what’s wrong with DOS2 having the FAT12 partition accessible? That seems useful if you need to copy something over for DOS1 mode. If it’s the only reason to not mount all active partitions, I wouldn’t let that hold it back.

I would prefer that as well to mark the partitions you would like to have mounted as active.

By sdsnatcher73

Prophet (2229)

sdsnatcher73's picture

28-08-2021, 13:15

The issue is with C: for me is not just consistency with Windows, it is consistency with all MSX models.

If you have a model with disk ROM in slot 0 (like a Sony HB-F500) and Nextor in higher slot (as there is no lower slot) the floppy drives already get A: and B: and Nextor gets C:. And to allow disk ROM to go first should not be too difficult, many ROM software already does it by just hooking into H.STKE and continuing after disk ROM is finished. Again it does not have to be the default option (I understand some people have gotten used to A: for their mass storage), it could even just be a build option with that version having the start address somewhere in empty space, hooking to H.STKE and on return jump to the regular start address. Of course in the end a NEXTOR.INI with INITDISKFIRST=Y would be optimal (but granted more work and as I am the only putz interested in it not worth it Wink)

Page 2/3
1 | | 3